Denise LeDuc Froemming, President & CEO, California Society of CPAs

The organization dates back to 1909. I believe you’re the largest professional association of CPAs in the United States. Will you start by giving us a brief introduction to where the organization stands today?

Today, we have over 40,000 members of CPAs, and I would say that’s one of our strengths as an organization. We are the largest CPA society in the nation, and of course, we say of the fourth or fifth largest economy in the world. We have CPAs, and the breadth of what they do is extensive. They are in the areas of tax, assurance, auditing, forensics, estate planning, and personal financial planning. Their expertise extends to corporate America in many different companies and large organizations such as CFOs and so forth; there is a very extensive breadth of what they all do.

Then, as far as the sectors therein, especially in California, you have entertainment, tech, and healthcare. There’s so much breadth of industry here that our membership is just very diverse. When you think of perspectives and overall diversity within gender, ethnicity, and whatever it may be, we have that breadth. So, that is one thing that makes us unique and is our strength because we have those members who can advocate. 

It allows us to be much stronger in the advocacy perspective because we can use their perspectives and have a feedback loop for legislators and regulators, communicating what they’re experiencing in business and then communicating that back to legislators. This policy you want to pass may not be as helpful and beneficial in the business as you think. And so we help and really are that liaison between both worlds. So, that’s been really one of our strengths as well.

Understood. And what will you say are the keys to the success of the organization to be this prominent?

We definitely want the community and networks, so that membership piece is key to everything we do. We have a lot of roundtables because our members and non-members, the community of CPAs and accountants like to come together and have conversations and really understand what each other is doing. So we have committees,

task forces, and various bodies that allow them to come together and have these conversations. I would say, too, from the learning perspective and knowledge, we have some of the top individuals in the industry, especially if you look at forensics and the tax and audit perspective. And they come together and really provide that knowledge base that they share, and it allows others to really have more understanding of what’s happening in our world. 

We say, like In hockey, we want to be where the puck is going and not necessarily where the puck is, right? So, we need to future-proof the profession and make sure we understand what’s coming down the pipeline so that we can help educate our members and help the profession get to where it needs to go. 

And I’ll just give you an example of that. Now, when you think of AI and ESG, specifically AI, and that’s moving so fast, we need to be where that’s going from a policy perspective. So, we’ve talked to legislators about that and ESG, but then we also need to make sure we have education and learning so that members know this is what’s happening in our world; here’s where we need to go. We have a lot of tech, and so a lot of our education and learning is from that perspective. Then, we try to create learning in modalities that resonate with individuals. So it may be nano learning, competency-based webinars, or podcasts. Wherever our learners are, we try to meet them where they’re at.

What will you say are the organization’s main offerings today?

It is on the membership side, but it’s looking at the community. So, how do we bring people together? It’s on the learning side; it’s bringing together the standards and advocacy. So it’s making sure that we advocate for the profession, and it’s also looking at the pipeline. So, we have a number of individuals within our organization who are focused on what’s the pipeline of future candidates and students who are interested in accounting. And so it’s bringing them together and helping to kind of look at that message, and how we make sure that young professionals and students are interested in the profession and then bring them forward. So, it’s really convening different minds and having that learning so we can advance the profession and collaborate with partners. I mean, that’s definitely a piece that is important to us.

Victor, it’s also bringing together the more national piece. So, being leaders there, as well as the locals, we deal with a lot. We have 14 different chapters or local area networks that we bring together individuals to have conversations that pertain to the profession, but also to learn and have these roundtable discussions. So, it’s a lot about convening the profession together.

What will be your message to those looking to become CPAs in the near future?

I would say there is definitely a need for CPAs. We know there’s a shortage out there, so there’s a need. There are also a lot of opportunities to become a CPA. It’s really a foundation, and it opens the door for so many other opportunities. So, a number of our members started out as CPAs, maybe doing audits or taxes, and they’ve moved into CEO positions. They moved into partner positions. They moved from public to corporate. So, it really is a door opener for anything you want to do in the business.

And I’ll just give you myself. I started out my CPA. I started out doing taxes for a not-for-profit and shifted. I’ve been in healthcare real estate. And now, I’m running a CPA organization. So, it just opens the door and allows you to explore so many different possibilities and pathways that are available. Whether it’s forensic, tax, or whatever it is, it’s a real gateway to help you be an advisor in anything that you do. The future is bright. That’s what I would say. The future is very bright.

That’s actually a great message, considering how the last three years have been. You know everybody is more positive this year. I would like to ask what the association’s market development will be like as well. Where do you see the association going in the near future?

You know, definitely, it’s a race for relevancy. So we have to make sure that we’re relevant in the future. So, some of what we’re looking at is modernizing the pathway to becoming a CPA. What does that look like? How can we remove some of the barriers that are out there and work together to make sure that we make that pathway just as rigorous as it is, but remove those barriers? So, some of the cost barriers and some of the barriers that make it difficult to become a CPA. So we’re working together nationally and on a state level, just seeing where we can go to make sure that we make that pathway available.

And I would say to the messaging, one of our pillars to the organization is shifting the identity of the profession. A lot of times, Victor, you probably hear people talk about, “Oh, they’re just number crunchers,” or you know, “They’re just looking at financials, and that’s all they’re doing.” But there’s so much more, and we’re trying to shift that message. That’s why we rebranded last year, looking at more of the totality of what is possible within the profession and saying, “One of our forensic leaders was one of the expert witnesses in the Johnny Depp trial.” We have those who are CFOs for the Warriors basketball team. We have CFOs in the cannabis industry. 

There’s so much opportunity, and we need to change the message that’s out there to say there are a lot of possibilities if you have your CPA. It’s not the traditional trajectory, which is fabulous, but there’s so much more opportunity. So, that’s one pillar: shifting the identity of the profession and also transforming the career experience. 

So, how do you really understand and have knowledge about everything that’s happening? We want to make sure that we create some education that’s more competency-based and bite-size so it’s relevant to anywhere you are in your career experience. And you can ride a bike and get a podcast. I do that all the time. I’m listening to podcasts. But it’s how you consume some of that knowledge and what we’re offering.

We offer courses from like Titans of Tax. So, it’s a very tax-heavy focus. We offer wellness courses to make sure that CPAs focus on that piece as well. Then, there is anything from personal financial planning to state planning to Game AI and ESG. So, the knowledge base is very extensive, and making sure that you have all those elements needed to be successful, so you can be an advisor to businesses to make sure that we can make the dreams of small and large businesses come true.

For businesses that start out with one employee, we help them gain a perspective that allows them to grow and help the economy grow. I’ll give you one statistic that blew my mind: Small local businesses return 60% to the economy, whereas chains return 40%. So, really looking at how we help those small businesses grow and thrive, it really helps communities and the business community at large. So, that’s definitely something we’re focused on as well.

Actually, that reminds me of some other interviews I’ve had recently in the education sector. I met Lincoln University from San Francisco, and they are focusing on the MBA, which is very flexible because most of the people who do their MBA are also working. So it’s similar to what you’re saying. At the same time, it’s very affordable at $20,000 to do the MBA with them, while Stanford or Berkley is way more expensive. The president also focused on affordable education for underserved communities. So, in a way, it’s very similar. In your case, the CPA is essentially a Swiss knife that can serve many different roles. So, we can definitely highlight that. And I would like to ask, we have had a wonderful discussion that was really compelling. What would be the final message that you would like to send across through this piece?

Yeah, if I can just make one mention of what you’re talking about the flexibility. We are doing a significant program. It’s called the Community College to CPA Program. So, it’s CC to CPA. We’re working on how we can attract those community college individuals and professionals. So it’s really those from underrepresented communities, pull them in, and have a flexible pathway for them. So, that has been key and top-of-mind for us as well. The new CPA evolution is focused on a program that’s more flexible and tied to the marketplace. So, I just want to mention those two things.

As a final message, I would just say that we really need to work together to make sure we’re focused on amplifying our impact. So, when you join an association, it’s really a multiplier effect. There’s a book out there by Liz Wiseman, and it is called “Multipliers.” I’m reading it now, and I think of the multiplier effect. It’s how you can do so much more, and your voice is so much more impactful if you all join together. And that’s what we try to do: bring together these 40,000 or more CPAs and then more in the nation to say, “What can we do together that we couldn’t do alone? So, it’s kind of like we all think one plus one equals two. It’s really one plus one equals five, right? What can we do together that we can’t do alone? And so, we’re focused on advocating and educating, convening partners. So, that’s also a multiplier effect, but it amplifies and makes an impact where we couldn’t do that from a single perspective.

So, that’s really the voice of what we’re trying to do. And I would say, too, that when we think about our overall purpose, we call it a massive, transformative purpose. But when we think about what that is, we really think about ensuring a financial world that everyone can trust because we’re the trusted advisors that are out there.